I'm curious about something, you mentioned and I've seen it mentioned elsewhere as well, 5th gen kpop, what would that mean in relation to earlier gens, how it's different and do you know how it started or who belongs to 5th gen?
I'm with you on disappointment if groups release only singles for a long time and the album is then a compilation of those singles. I think they're trying to follow how it's done in the west?? Although.. I'm not that familiar with how western musicians do it. 1-2 songs of a single is always a bit of a disappointment though.
I also think that the reason for this strategy of releasing singles instead of albums is to appeal to western audiences and I'm not happy about it at all! The 2-3 albums per year custom is one of the things that makes kpop kpop so I hope this won't completely change in the future. But I also know it costs much less for companies to release singles with shorter and less intense promotions while these still keep the group in the public's mind, so there's that too.
I actually love to talk about kpop generations and I have a lot of opinions about them! I really want to write an article about it someday - it's one of my many many ideas for longform content that I want to release here, it's just that my current life circumstances don't really leave a lot of time and mental energy for the research and serious writing those would entail.
To answer somewhat briefly, there isn't a consensus on when the 5th generation started but I do have my own theory. I think we can only tie the start of a new generation to a significant event that caused a big shift in one way or another, one that's affected all the groups that debuted from that point on. For girl groups, I identify the start of the 5th gen with NewJeans's debut, for boy groups, with the survival show Boys Planet. My reasons are that NewJeans heralded a new genre (what I think is now called 'easy listening' in kpop) and promoted a distinct aesthetic and style that was previously not present and that became a blueprint for many groups that followed. As for Boys Planet, it also caused a huge shift in the boy group landscape, partly because the resulting group, Zerobaseone ignited the ongoing renaissance of the lighthearted, refreshing concepts for boy groups (as opposed to the 4th gen where more aggressive, hard-hitting, darker, and sexy concepts were the most successful) but also because a huge percentage of boy groups that have debuted since have former BP contestants in them or are somehow related to the show/ZB1. So in my interpretation, every group that debuted after these points are 5th gen.
I would also say that there are circumstantial factors in identifying the 5th gen. For example, debuting right before or during Covid was the fundamental experience of most 4th gen groups which made a huge impact on their identities, music, art, etc., while 5th gen groups debuted at the tail end of Covid or the so-called post-Covid era so they had a distinctly different experience as idols which I think influences their art too.
The last thing I think is important is a paradigm shift in general, in the idols' way of thinking and in how they are managed. For example, I noticed that 5th gen idols are usually lot more aware of western culture and are influenced by it heavily, they speak English better, they seem to be more aware of social issues (I only saw signs pointing to this) and probably as a result, they have a more individualistic spirit. This is also reflected in their performance styles because as I observed, synchronized group dancing is sometimes less important in this generation than showing the individual colors of all members. I think the way they are managed is different too because there are things getting normalized that used to be unimaginable, like idols already having several visible tattoos when debuting and constantly getting new ones while being rookies. Also, while interactions between idols of different genders was a biiig taboo in 4th gen, it doesn't seem to be an issue in 5th gen.
Anyway, this was my brief summary that ended up being a mini essay, hopefully you won't mind 😅 I will probably come back here and use this when I eventually write that article but it was nice talking about it because I've been thinking about it a lot but have never really written it down!
Thank you for taking the time to write this! That was super interesting to read! A post about kpop generations would be as well, if you get around to it.
I think it's quite nice to stretch summer out a little bit longer! This post is a nice way to remind me of that time, haha.
Ahh, A.C.E! I have a friend on Twitter who really loves them, so most of what I know about them is via that route, haha. I've listened to a few of their songs but definitely need to try more. All the guys seem so fun, and Junhee in particular - his face is so expressive, I love it!
I am going to have to check out She A Wolf! I have a certain fondness for wolves thanks to my all-time favourite character, Nighteyes, so I would love to hear about these other wolfy K-pop songs, haha. Off the top of my head, I know ONEUS' Leader and Mr. Wolf 😆
I remember my Shawol friend showing me Key's Tongue Tied, but I don't remember it being Japanese?! But, then again, I am known for listening to songs in English from K-pop artists and then realising after like the fifth listen that all the lyrics are English, haha 💀
"Unnatural and Bad Blood are both heavy on Latin music" - uhhhh, I will definitelyyy have to listen to these Eunbi songs, then!! 😍
I added your playlist to my library - I'm excited to listen!
Haha, I thought the same, I love reminiscing about summer and what songs I enjoyed but since everything keeps happening so fast in the realm of kpop, I am haunted by the thought of these articles being irrelevant to most people when it's so 'late'! That's so funny btw when I look at the broader picture of how non-kpop artists take 3 years to release something new and we get 2-3 albums per year 😂
I hope you can get into A.C.E more!! 🥹 They're so amazing, I keep promoting them everywhere! And Junhee is my favorite so I have to say, you have good taste that you noticed his expressions first 😌
Ahh, I had to look up Nighteyes but now I know he's a Robin Hobb character! That's a fandom I have to get into hehe. I've been planning to read her books since 2018 😅 Some of the famous kpop songs with wolf imagery that come to my mind are Wolfgang by Stray Kids, Wolf by EXO (that one's more infamous though because it's a bit ridiculous 😆), Wolf Baby by TRCNG, Wolf & Sheep by H.O.T (a real classic from 1997 but it was also covered by NCT more recently), Before the Full Moon Rises by GOT7 and less explicitly Howling by Victon. But there's probably more I don't know 😂
I'm the same btw, I usually don't register that a song is English or Japanese until after a few listens! For Taemin's Famous it took me years though to realize it was a Japanese song 🙈
I actually made a mistake with the Eunbi songs, Unnatural is definitely more R&B but Bad Blood does have those Latin influences! I'll have to correct that in the post too, haha. And your comment gave me the idea to compile a playlist of my favorite kpop songs with Latin
music influences, there are so many!!
Let me know which songs you liked when you listen to it eventually 🤗
Omg if you do get into the Hobb fandom, I won't be able to shut up about it (although actually, it's been a while since I read the books, so I really ought to refresh my memory, heh). Oh yeah, EXO's Wolf I have heard, and I love Howling!! I will have to check out the others! I think I also heard WayV's She A Wolf via you too??
Please do share the link when you make the Latin-influence playlist. 😍
Haha that's so funny, brings back memories of me trying to explain every aspect of kpop to my non-kpop friends 😂
Omg that clip of Junhee and Donghun 😂 I think I saw it once ages ago. Junhee does have the most amazing reactions! That reminds me, I'm seeing A.C.E in less than a week and I bought tickets to take polaroid photos with Junhee 😭 I can't believe I'll get to see him irl...
I'll let you know when I get into the Hobb fandom but you'll probably hear about it on bookstagram if I do 😁 Did you like the wolf-themed songs? Actually, you did hear about WayV's She a Wolf through the post we're commenting on hehe 🤭
Omggg a Polaroid with Junhee! I hope it’s an amazing experience, and I can’t wait to hear all about it!
Haha, indeed, I did get She a Wolf via you. 😌😌 I did, but actually you’ve reminded me that I need to go back and listen more before maybe making a little wolfy playlist, heh.
I do have more wolfy recommendations for you, actually! The group &Team has a werewolf concept so they have quite a few songs in this topic, I'd suggest listening to Running with the pack and W. O. L. F. They're not technically kpop because most of the members are Japanese but they're under a kpop company and I think the lines are getting blurred a lot these days.
I do hope to write a separate post about my A. C. E concert experience like I did with Seventeen 😊
Thank you for your through article again.
I'm curious about something, you mentioned and I've seen it mentioned elsewhere as well, 5th gen kpop, what would that mean in relation to earlier gens, how it's different and do you know how it started or who belongs to 5th gen?
I'm with you on disappointment if groups release only singles for a long time and the album is then a compilation of those singles. I think they're trying to follow how it's done in the west?? Although.. I'm not that familiar with how western musicians do it. 1-2 songs of a single is always a bit of a disappointment though.
Thank you for reading 🤗
I also think that the reason for this strategy of releasing singles instead of albums is to appeal to western audiences and I'm not happy about it at all! The 2-3 albums per year custom is one of the things that makes kpop kpop so I hope this won't completely change in the future. But I also know it costs much less for companies to release singles with shorter and less intense promotions while these still keep the group in the public's mind, so there's that too.
I actually love to talk about kpop generations and I have a lot of opinions about them! I really want to write an article about it someday - it's one of my many many ideas for longform content that I want to release here, it's just that my current life circumstances don't really leave a lot of time and mental energy for the research and serious writing those would entail.
To answer somewhat briefly, there isn't a consensus on when the 5th generation started but I do have my own theory. I think we can only tie the start of a new generation to a significant event that caused a big shift in one way or another, one that's affected all the groups that debuted from that point on. For girl groups, I identify the start of the 5th gen with NewJeans's debut, for boy groups, with the survival show Boys Planet. My reasons are that NewJeans heralded a new genre (what I think is now called 'easy listening' in kpop) and promoted a distinct aesthetic and style that was previously not present and that became a blueprint for many groups that followed. As for Boys Planet, it also caused a huge shift in the boy group landscape, partly because the resulting group, Zerobaseone ignited the ongoing renaissance of the lighthearted, refreshing concepts for boy groups (as opposed to the 4th gen where more aggressive, hard-hitting, darker, and sexy concepts were the most successful) but also because a huge percentage of boy groups that have debuted since have former BP contestants in them or are somehow related to the show/ZB1. So in my interpretation, every group that debuted after these points are 5th gen.
I would also say that there are circumstantial factors in identifying the 5th gen. For example, debuting right before or during Covid was the fundamental experience of most 4th gen groups which made a huge impact on their identities, music, art, etc., while 5th gen groups debuted at the tail end of Covid or the so-called post-Covid era so they had a distinctly different experience as idols which I think influences their art too.
The last thing I think is important is a paradigm shift in general, in the idols' way of thinking and in how they are managed. For example, I noticed that 5th gen idols are usually lot more aware of western culture and are influenced by it heavily, they speak English better, they seem to be more aware of social issues (I only saw signs pointing to this) and probably as a result, they have a more individualistic spirit. This is also reflected in their performance styles because as I observed, synchronized group dancing is sometimes less important in this generation than showing the individual colors of all members. I think the way they are managed is different too because there are things getting normalized that used to be unimaginable, like idols already having several visible tattoos when debuting and constantly getting new ones while being rookies. Also, while interactions between idols of different genders was a biiig taboo in 4th gen, it doesn't seem to be an issue in 5th gen.
Anyway, this was my brief summary that ended up being a mini essay, hopefully you won't mind 😅 I will probably come back here and use this when I eventually write that article but it was nice talking about it because I've been thinking about it a lot but have never really written it down!
Thank you for taking the time to write this! That was super interesting to read! A post about kpop generations would be as well, if you get around to it.
I think it's quite nice to stretch summer out a little bit longer! This post is a nice way to remind me of that time, haha.
Ahh, A.C.E! I have a friend on Twitter who really loves them, so most of what I know about them is via that route, haha. I've listened to a few of their songs but definitely need to try more. All the guys seem so fun, and Junhee in particular - his face is so expressive, I love it!
I am going to have to check out She A Wolf! I have a certain fondness for wolves thanks to my all-time favourite character, Nighteyes, so I would love to hear about these other wolfy K-pop songs, haha. Off the top of my head, I know ONEUS' Leader and Mr. Wolf 😆
I remember my Shawol friend showing me Key's Tongue Tied, but I don't remember it being Japanese?! But, then again, I am known for listening to songs in English from K-pop artists and then realising after like the fifth listen that all the lyrics are English, haha 💀
"Unnatural and Bad Blood are both heavy on Latin music" - uhhhh, I will definitelyyy have to listen to these Eunbi songs, then!! 😍
I added your playlist to my library - I'm excited to listen!
Haha, I thought the same, I love reminiscing about summer and what songs I enjoyed but since everything keeps happening so fast in the realm of kpop, I am haunted by the thought of these articles being irrelevant to most people when it's so 'late'! That's so funny btw when I look at the broader picture of how non-kpop artists take 3 years to release something new and we get 2-3 albums per year 😂
I hope you can get into A.C.E more!! 🥹 They're so amazing, I keep promoting them everywhere! And Junhee is my favorite so I have to say, you have good taste that you noticed his expressions first 😌
Ahh, I had to look up Nighteyes but now I know he's a Robin Hobb character! That's a fandom I have to get into hehe. I've been planning to read her books since 2018 😅 Some of the famous kpop songs with wolf imagery that come to my mind are Wolfgang by Stray Kids, Wolf by EXO (that one's more infamous though because it's a bit ridiculous 😆), Wolf Baby by TRCNG, Wolf & Sheep by H.O.T (a real classic from 1997 but it was also covered by NCT more recently), Before the Full Moon Rises by GOT7 and less explicitly Howling by Victon. But there's probably more I don't know 😂
I'm the same btw, I usually don't register that a song is English or Japanese until after a few listens! For Taemin's Famous it took me years though to realize it was a Japanese song 🙈
I actually made a mistake with the Eunbi songs, Unnatural is definitely more R&B but Bad Blood does have those Latin influences! I'll have to correct that in the post too, haha. And your comment gave me the idea to compile a playlist of my favorite kpop songs with Latin
music influences, there are so many!!
Let me know which songs you liked when you listen to it eventually 🤗
LOL that reminds me of my non-kpop friends being like "comeback? where are they coming back from??" 😂
Oh, I have remembered this glorious clip, which is still so funny every time I watch it 😭😂 https://x.com/sehnippoppo/status/1762500306028409317 Junhee's eyes LOL
Omg if you do get into the Hobb fandom, I won't be able to shut up about it (although actually, it's been a while since I read the books, so I really ought to refresh my memory, heh). Oh yeah, EXO's Wolf I have heard, and I love Howling!! I will have to check out the others! I think I also heard WayV's She A Wolf via you too??
Please do share the link when you make the Latin-influence playlist. 😍
Haha that's so funny, brings back memories of me trying to explain every aspect of kpop to my non-kpop friends 😂
Omg that clip of Junhee and Donghun 😂 I think I saw it once ages ago. Junhee does have the most amazing reactions! That reminds me, I'm seeing A.C.E in less than a week and I bought tickets to take polaroid photos with Junhee 😭 I can't believe I'll get to see him irl...
I'll let you know when I get into the Hobb fandom but you'll probably hear about it on bookstagram if I do 😁 Did you like the wolf-themed songs? Actually, you did hear about WayV's She a Wolf through the post we're commenting on hehe 🤭
Omggg a Polaroid with Junhee! I hope it’s an amazing experience, and I can’t wait to hear all about it!
Haha, indeed, I did get She a Wolf via you. 😌😌 I did, but actually you’ve reminded me that I need to go back and listen more before maybe making a little wolfy playlist, heh.
I do have more wolfy recommendations for you, actually! The group &Team has a werewolf concept so they have quite a few songs in this topic, I'd suggest listening to Running with the pack and W. O. L. F. They're not technically kpop because most of the members are Japanese but they're under a kpop company and I think the lines are getting blurred a lot these days.
I do hope to write a separate post about my A. C. E concert experience like I did with Seventeen 😊
Oh, a werewolf concept is interesting! I will have to check them out :D